I think leftists can sometimes get a bit tied in knots over this stuff, because we need to defend anti-imperialist action and there are a shitload of bad faith arguments about Hamas. Most of it is pretty typical whataboutism. A state is perpetrating a genocide against Palestine and has been doing so for decades at this point. The resistance against it could commit a hundred Oct. 7s and not come close to the level of violence committed against the Palestinian people. It’s very understandable to handwave it away and dismiss it, but yeah, we should just briefly accept that violence against innocent people is wrong and immediately turn it back to Israel, who, by far, hurt and kill way more innocent people than Hamas ever could.
It’s very understandable to handwave it away and dismiss it,
I very much disagree. Handwaving it and dismissing it misses the entire point of why deliberately murdering civilians is bad.
but yeah, we should just briefly accept that violence against innocent people is wrong and immediately turn it back to Israel, who, by far, hurt and kill way more innocent people than Hamas ever could.
I don’t know about ‘ever could’ - if the IDF was entirely incompetent instead of just vile, I wouldn’t trust Hamas not to simply play this card in reverse. Their long history of antisemitism remains… suspect. On top of being theocratic loons.
But that’s why Israel supported Hamas to undermine Fatah. Much easier target for Israeli PR.
If we’re willing to handwave away the civilian murdering, then what do we have against the IDF? Like, that’s the reason I don’t like them, and that’s also the reason I don’t like Hamas
I think leftists can sometimes get a bit tied in knots over this stuff, because we need to defend anti-imperialist action and there are a shitload of bad faith arguments about Hamas. Most of it is pretty typical whataboutism. A state is perpetrating a genocide against Palestine and has been doing so for decades at this point. The resistance against it could commit a hundred Oct. 7s and not come close to the level of violence committed against the Palestinian people. It’s very understandable to handwave it away and dismiss it, but yeah, we should just briefly accept that violence against innocent people is wrong and immediately turn it back to Israel, who, by far, hurt and kill way more innocent people than Hamas ever could.
I very much disagree. Handwaving it and dismissing it misses the entire point of why deliberately murdering civilians is bad.
I don’t know about ‘ever could’ - if the IDF was entirely incompetent instead of just vile, I wouldn’t trust Hamas not to simply play this card in reverse. Their long history of antisemitism remains… suspect. On top of being theocratic loons.
But that’s why Israel supported Hamas to undermine Fatah. Much easier target for Israeli PR.
If we’re willing to handwave away the civilian murdering, then what do we have against the IDF? Like, that’s the reason I don’t like them, and that’s also the reason I don’t like Hamas
Turns out the situation there is morally very simple as long as you dehumanise either side.
Spoiler - the situation is anything but simple, morally or otherwise.