There were also 2 more below that.
And this must be a bot, endless posts by this user, every time the same content on multiple communities.
Daily Reminder, Discussion is okay. Name caling, vitriol and toxic behaviour is against our community rules. Nothing is worth an argument. Discuss away but leave the aggression at the door.
It goes without saying, but any user included in the post should not be harassed. Those found to be following this person will be banned from the community.
Here’s my idea:
It’s a middle ground between completely hiding the duplicates, and letting them as is. Once you click that plus button, it shows the duplicates as full posts, otherwise it leaves them as just one-liners.
Can you put this suggestion on their Github issues tracker? It’s brilliant.
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I like this one. It conveys all of the pertinent cross posting info in a succinct manner.
There is discussion on going at !news@lemmy.world currently about new rules. Users posting the same story from the same source will be blocked by an automod. I asked about users posting the same story from different sources, and apparently that’s absolutely fine. So expect this problem to get a lot worse before steps have to be taken to make it better :/
I feel like the best way to handle the situation with similar/same communities on different instances is to allow communities to automatically federated with other communities. That way subscribing to one community will show you its posts and all the posts to its linked communities.
It would be especially helpful for these general purpose communities like Technology or News since I would imagine most communities are going to have one.
If that happens then we wouldn’t need to hunt down and follow every single instance of the same community. Let the mods handle it on their end to save the rest of us the effort.
w o r l d n e w s
It’s the same motherfucker just karma farming
Farming what? There is no karma on lemmy
There is karma on lemmy, available through api
okay but literally no one cares about that
No one except the aforementioned motherfucker
so why do you care about them caring
Why do you care about them caring about them caring HUH?!
good point, why do you care though?
I also choose this guys mother
Maybe he just hates Zuckerberg that much haha
There is a cross post feature, and the resuting post appears to be aware it was cross posted - it would be nice if Lemmy would consolidate those to one post that appears in multiple communities, or at least show you only one of them.
Lemmy needs cross communities that exist across instances otherwise it’s going to get more and more fragmented
Why do people insist that there needs to be (for example) /c/politics on every instance? Really, there are only 3 or 4 with any substantial traffic, and there are good reasons to pick one over the others, and they are the same good reasons for them to be separate.
Why do people insist that there needs to be (for example) /c/politics on every instance?
This is a fundamental issue with the way that lemmy is organized that was identified early. Its a design consideration thats pretty much baked into the cake that each lemmy instance effectively tries to be an entire reddit.
Its a bit of an issue, because this will necessarily dilute the kind of network effect that is what allows social media to be as engaging as it can be. Interesting articles don’t get as much momentum. The interaction is more diffuse. Conversations are more spread out and fragmented.
Its beyond the scope of the current design, and I really do commend the developers for what they’ve built (lemmy as is a great experience); however, a more ‘instance’ based approach may have made more sense based on how we’ve seen things scale. Instead of every lemmy instance trying to be ‘all of reddit’ each lemmy instance would focus on a set of niches (for example, a fashion focused instance would have c/fashion, c/mens_fashion_advice, c/streetware,… whatever); then they would federate to propage these niche across the fediverse.
The Star Trek lemmy instance is an example of this. Its a home for all things star trek. I also tried to start something like that focused around WallStreetBets, but afaik, WSB had almost no exodus.
More importantly, the critical mass to get enough users for the content to be interesting didn’t happen. There were too many competing /c’s across the lemmyverse. So articles get posted, but none get more than 1-3 upvotes because the userbase that would get it to say 5-15 upvotes simply isn’t there.
I really do love lemmy for what it is, but this design consideration is absolutely what is preventing Lemmy from being a true Reddit killer. The structure of federation sets lemmy(s) up in a way that there is an inherent blocking factor to super-connectivity.
However, I can imagine a couple solutions to this that dont necessarily require a full burn down and rethinking of lemmy.
One would be to allow for the merging of communities. Users set up C’s, but if there was some way to do a kind of merge (as like on github), where the two RSS feeds could be merged (as in github). Likewise, it would make sense if there were a way to ‘split’ or fork communties, as in, say you’ve got c/fashion, and some one wants to fork off and have it become c/mens_fashion. This would allow communities to consolidate around critical mass (there are enough posts, comments, etc to represent meaningful engagement), and then also to diffuse that issue latter when it makes sense to maybe split off political memes from say, political discussion.
A second solution would be to allow communities to be ‘transferred’ across the federation. This makes sense in that your ‘local’ community should be comprised of the things you care about the most (fashion, mens fashion, streetware, etc…). This feature would allow niche communities to consolidate into single instances, which will also serve to drive engagement (a user of mens fashion is far more likely to post into streetware and vice versus).
A third option would be to build a super structure to lemmy that allows for the consolidation of multiple lemmy RSS feeds into one. Effectively, user would be able to identify various lemmy communities into ‘supper communities’ that consolidate them under a single heading (a tool to grab up all the 'mens fashion advice /c’s across the fediverse) and deliver it in a single RSS feed.
Of the three of these the third option makes the most sense to me. It requires the least rework of the underlying data structures, and seems like a bolt on solution. However, it also might be the least effective of the three. I’ve no intuition about what that would do the structure of the network or if it would aid in overcoming critical thresholds of engagement.
Having instances focused on one specific thing is the best solution, but it requires a couple other problems to be solved first.
The biggest one is discovery. Lets take your example of a fashion instance, hypothetically we’ll call it fashion.world. Lets assume I’m a user interested in fashion setting here on lemmy.world, and I want to subscribe to a fashion community. Currently the lowest resistance method is to hop over to the local community list and scroll through looking for any fashion related communities. If I’m a little more savvy maybe I hop over to the search option and take a crack at some plausible sounding community names starting with just fashion. That might work, but it relies on lemmy.world already being federated with fashion.world, which in turn relies on another user having already found and subscribed to one of their communities. On a very large instance like this one that’s probably a decent chance of having occurred, but on small or obscure instances it’s very unlikely. So we have a massive discoverability problem now. There needs to be some kind of centralized registry where you can type a term and see all the communities across all the instances that might be related to that term.
Another related problem is that instances, communities, and users, are closely bound to each other. I think it was a mistake to put everything together. It simplified things in the early days, it makes it possible to treat a lemmy instance as a mini-reddit, but it causes problems in the long run. Instead you should have a service for users to authenticate with and federate user messages and such, and an instance for communities to be hosted out of and federated. This would also simplify some aspects of moderation as user instances could setup a consistent set of rules they expect their users to follow. If you get caught not following those rules you get banned from the instance. Communities then could have their own rules they setup and via de-federation with different user registries you’d have a quick way of deciding the kinds of users you want in your community. Seeing a lot of hate speech coming out of the user registry run like a 4chan board? Sorry fellas, ban hammer time, that’s why you can’t have nice things. Not to mention breaking users and communities apart lets things scale in a more natural fashion, where the load the community server is under is directly proportional to the interest in those communities rather than if that instance happened to be the most well known one when someone went to register their account.
Spot on about the discovery issue. My concern with your outline though is its a total rework. My thinking is that the die is cast with regards to this experiment. So in that sense we kind of have to work with what we have.
Just bc there are 100 things called /c/whatever doesn’t mean people will fragment. On Reddit, the only difference is the names would have to be different in a new way. You can quickly sort by active, find the active community, and use it. The others will die, and the network effect will live.
The others will die, and the network effect will live.
No it wont.
Before I knew about Lemmy I was in the process of designing my own replacement platform. While I think that decentralization is good, I felt like it should be done at the community level. So everyone is federated to a few user account instances, then each community is a self-hosted instance.
Obviously we’re too far past that point to do it with Lemmy, but it does feel like federation can be an obstacle as much as it can be a benefit
when admins leavy defederation like a nuclear weapon, you know its a problem.
This also happened on reddit
It did, but it wasn’t as bad as this. My hope is that as Lemmy matures, this will happen less.
It got lost on the noise of reddit. There’s no way lemmy has more bots, let alone a higher ratio to users.
And it’s entirely up to your instance, the instance I am in has strict bot rules that other instances bots must follow.
wtf do the bots have to do with this? the issue is that multiple communities are all talking about the same article in many different places when they should be all talking about it in 1.
Absolutely not, the benefit of each community having its own vibe is exactly that.
Think of it it like this, one community is for Germans and one is for the French. They can talk about the same thing, but they will Absolutely go about it differently, and that’s fine. Pick which one you want to help/join, or hit up both.
Were not talking about language barriers, were talking about people building arbitrary walls where none are needed. There is 0 reson that there are over a dozen “technology” communities. If there was simply 1 community to focus on these topics the whole place would function much more smoothly. The core problems with Lemmy is that all of the communities are fragmented and spread out, by force of the admins too. This means small communities will never get populated unless a massive monolithic instance comes about to dwarf the rest. Right now, the largest video game communities on the internet don’t get even a post a day. The only things that get traction here are politics, tech, and memes, because they are the most universal topics that can be minimally sustained on any online platform. Until the users and admins of Lemmy realize they need to agnosticize content, communities, and users from instances, this place will crumble under its fundamental framework. We need to be like email, and let the users build their spaces, not the few who decide to host the servers.
Who said anything about language barriers? It’s dialects and interests, they just do things differently, and if they are in the same place (like Reddit) you get circle jerks and other BS for no reason. Just like people don’t “shoot the shit” with work colleagues like gaming buddies, things are just different and that’s not always a bad thing. If I want to have a gaming type discussion I would join the gaming technology community, if I wanted an in-depth conversation, I may have to join educated technology.
Lemmy removes this, if you want this to be a Reddit clone, you came to the wrong place, you clearly don’t understand the intent of this place.
Again, no issue with lemmy, you came in here wanting and expecting something else. If that’s the case, this place isn’t for you and move on instead of trying to make it something it has no intention of being (Reddit)
Who said anything about language barriers?
you did.
The only way it happens less is if lemmy actually does something to merge communities or treat cross posts as a single post.
unless communities and users become agnostic to instances, this problem will never be solvable. also defederation makes this virtually impossible.
It shouldn’t be that difficult to give mods or administration the ability to name communities that “super federate” and appear as local to all instances. That or make Instances more agnostic.
a simple flaw in this design is that users on lemmy.world and users on beehaw.org are not federated, so how do we resolve that issue for a community that is on .ml, .world, beehaw, and nsfw, beehaw would have to support content from world, who they are currently defederated with, or their users would just not see content from world users. the whole premise of defederation is ironically antithetical to the premise of federation. by making a larger group of distributed users, the system could work great. but the admins are taking their personal issues to each other causing fractures that make adoption for newer users and more laymen basically impossible. that whole “it doesn’t matter what instance you use” is complete BS at this point since half of the top 5 instances are defederated frome at least 1 other.
That’s a Whole lot of words to say I want a Reddit clone.
Go fix Reddit instead of making this something it’s not.
It won’t.
Its not really surprising to see duplicate from what are basically all ‘general-purpose’ instances. Merging duplicate posts into one would be a great solution.
But did you know about the nearly 50% reduction in Threads users???
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But I have to say that’s a plus. I’m on Lemmy.ca and beehaw.org is federated with my instance so I can interact with their communities. I have noticed that discussions on technology@beehaw.org are different from those on technology@lemmy.world. I think that’s the beauty of Fediverse.
It’s like being in a technology club in France and then visiting the technology club in Germany. They may look like the same clubs on the surface, but then you realize that these clubs have different interests and the discussions are different because the worldviews of the two clubs are different.
That’s true for some communities, but for instance !technology@lemmy.world and !technology@lemmy.ml are pretty similar, and tend to have the same content posted by bots.
I can understand why this can be annoying.
Absolutely! While communities might share a name across multiple instances, the content and discussions can be quite different.
I kinda like things this way. The idea is that instance A will have their own users talking about news article Z while instance B will also be talking about it, each with their own perspectives.
Right now it feels like all the discussions are the same because Lemmy and Kbin haven’t had time to evolve and differentiate themselves much just yet. As far as I can tell there’s two types of early adopters populating this ecosystem: Left-leaning tech folks and right-leaning trolls testing the waters to see how much attention they can get. That might just be the communities I subscribed to though 🤷
and that isn’t how any platform works. this deliberate fragmentation will continue to kill lemmy’s potential and means any small coms will never get populated.
Who says the have to? Why are you wanting this to be like Reddit, even on Reddit there’s lots of thriving communities (subreddits) with under 500 users.
It’s what people make of it, and clearly this place isn’t for you, so move on.
Hell you even used a fucking Reddit trope as your username… shows what you expect here lmfao.
why is being like reddit a bad thing? it’s the best link aggregator on the internet. until new released the site was great. imagine not wanting a link aggregator like reddit before they made their own app and doomed the UX to modernized oblivion.
The solution is crossposting. If the threads on OP are all by the same user, then they should be crossposting, and mods should be warning them to do so.
It needs to be enabled on more mobile apps then.
If these are serial reporting, Threads is down by a factor of 8. Could be more. Antelope FWY 1/128 mile.
It seems useful to have bots serial posting for a while, within some limits.
These forums have a chicken and egg problem - need posts to get commentors, need the commentors to incintivise posters. Also just need content in general to get any readers.
But I’m in general agreement that recently the feeds haven’t been too smooth on Lemmy and that take a lot away from the browsing experience.
I don’t see the issue, it’s not a duplicate post, it’s 3 separate posts by the same person into different communities.
I don’t think this is all that dissimilar from how Reddit was though if you were subscribed to two world news subreddits and two technology subreddits. I think the key is picking out the more popular communities and only subscribing to those. Eventually the goal would be for the less popular communities to fizzle out in favor of bigger communities.
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I think bots are too agressive posting everywhere. example linkbot, it has posted over 20000 posts and its only one month old account.
