that is just sad. yet so many will say sexism does not exist
Pretty sure racism is also involved
Intersectionality
It’s as if, like, if you are a woman, and also in a disfavoured racial category, like, where they, uh, have overlap? Where they meet? It’s not the same as either one individually but its own, I guess nexus? I feel like there’s a better word for this
There’s a somewhat niche, but clever word for this particular combo - misogynoir
Coined by Moya Bailey in 2010
idk the point of your snark… people are still figuring out intersectionality. just give some education or stfu, dont condescend to people who are making an effort.
I think it’s called a “double minority”, but being a woman isn’t really a minority tho (edit: not a minority in the context of being 50% of the human population) so I don’t know if theres a better term than that.
I feel bad for people who are black, lesbian, neurodivergent, and trans-woman… like that’s a quadruple minority.
but being a woman isn’t really a minority tho
It depends on the context. In a Victoria’s Secret fashion show? Yeah, probably not the minority. In a tech role, which women are systemically harassed and bullied out of pursuing? Yeah, women are probably a minority.
The term is “intersectionality”. Conservatives really hated the term before they went all popeyed over “woke”.
That’s not what minority means in the sociological context. Volume is mathematical. Poor people are a minority and there’s more of them than the 1%. Being a minority is about lack of power, prestige and property. And intersectionality is the more formal term, but ‘double minority’ gets the point across.
but being a woman isn’t really a minority tho
They certainly are in computer science
@ReiRose@lemmy.world has it right, the term and idea is intersectionality.
apropos of nothing, intersectionality came out of critical race theory’s analyses of black womens outcomes in the legal system. the particular combination of oppression is literally the textbook example.
Yeah, online gaming has all but confirmed to me that sexism is very alive and well.
This is also common in the guitar community. Some women can shred like mofos, and here comes Jim-Bob McGraw saying their playing is tracked etc., ad nauseum
Can… Can I be the one sitting in that chair? (｡♡‿♡｡)
What does it mean if their playing is “tracked”? Genuinely have no clue.
Like they use a pre recorded track and then make a video
Lip syncing for guitarists
Sure there are. But then there are girls like Melle Baby who overshadow them not by only wearing underwear. Seriously, how do I get her out of my recommendations?
The funny thing is that in my experience female programmers usually have above average skills. I suspect it’s exactly because of this bias against women in tech. Where an average or below average dude can easily get by, this is much harder for women. As a result this bias acts as a kind of filter which results in female programmers being on average a little better than male programmers because all the average or below average ones get filtered out early.
Here’s hard data to match your experience:
“This paper presents the largest study to date on gender bias, where we compare acceptance rates of contributions from men versus women in an open source software community. Surprisingly, our results show that women’s contributions tend to be accepted more often than men’s. However, women’s acceptance rates are higher only when they are not identifiable as women. Our results suggest that although women on GitHub may be more competent overall, bias against them exists nonetheless.”
That’s probably just because women are smarter than men.
I might add, in the hostile environment women may feel compelled to try harder at least to make a point. As in, “I’ll show you what I can do”.
If she were a man, she’d be calling herself a polymath and everybody would be agreeing with her.
Hell, she’s be the meme for what a “real man” is instead of “gigachad.”
Even more rage inducing these comments would be the same if she wasn’t conventionally attractive.
Fucking programmers need a solid clip around the ear.
Claims to be able to program in C++, Java
“Pfft yeah probably only in Hello World”
No that’s Elon Musk. He’s full of shit. This Victoria Secret model can actually do something.
Nah Elon is not that useless, he knows how to change twitter’s icon
I’m sure he got someone to do that for him
Probably replaced “twitter_logo.png” with the x logo under the same name in an AWS bucket lmao
That’s actually pretty hard to do with a codebase as large as twitter’s must be. You would have to locate the frontend code for each front end they have (website, app, etc). For each front end, there will be multiple Twitter logos (different resolutions, icon version, etc.). And then you would have to replace all of them and push the changes through their pipelines.
I doubt musk can do that.
It’s incredible to me that people actually think Elon writes code at Twitter
Elon is a novice when it comes to programming.
That is obvious to any programmer who saw his antics at the beginning of the Twitter takeover.
I mean, the guy was claiming the people who added the most lines of codes are the ones with the most skills and are the ones allowed to stay.
While an amateur programmer needs 100 lines of code, a good programmer can do the same in less than 10 lines. Which is faster, more performant, wastes less resources, and is easier to read afterwards.
It is literally the opposite of what Musks claims.
And lose lawsuits
I was so glad we had a woman join our dev team some months ago. It’s more fun, more relaxed and we are able to get better results as we just cover a wider area of skills. People gatekeeping programming to include only men are idiots.
That poor girl. My gf’s only female teammate quit last month and i suggested she start grinding leetcode asap. Could you imagine being the only woman on a team? Pretty strong indicator that something is very wrong there.
Eh, my team is this way, but it’s because we’re aerospace adjacent which further compounds the problem. The only woman on our team is awesome and everyone gets along great. No one has an inflated ego or feels the need to one up each other though, which tends to be the root of the issue in my experience. Lots of tech bros feel the need to put others down, and see women as an easier target unfortunately.
Lots of tech bros
If you want women to feel welcome, you probably shouldn’t use gendered slurs.
I think they meant men in specific in this case. I don’t know that there’s a huge problem of women being sexist against other women in tech.
Still, it’s not productive to attribute shitty behavior to gender.
Are you suggesting it’s never about gender? There’s no such thing as sexism?
There’s no such thing as sexism?
That’s a bizarre conclusion to reach from what I’ve said.
Are you suggesting it’s never about gender?
It’s not about gender, indeed, it is about behavior and character of individuals. If you look at systemic and structural sexism, they are not about the gender of individuals in the system either.
If we want to reach parity, there’s gotta be some only woman at first.
It’s the same thing with any kind of diversity. Not an expert, but anecdotally, it seems to work better if you start adding diversity at the top. At least people at the senior+ level are generally more comfortable being outliers.
Pretty strong indicator that something is very wrong there.
Indeed. The gender gap already starts at the educational level, the workspace just reflects that reality. Not sure if you intended to, but it sounded like you were blaming the team/company for it.
I don’t think it’s necessarily an indicator of something wrong with the team. it’s not easy to hire women in this industry, there just aren’t that many of them. A team of 10 people with 1 woman isn’t a red flag, it’s unfortunately average. If we’re talking about a bigger team that’s a different story.
It’s somewhat easier if you hire immigrants. there are definitely more women devs from Eastern cultures than Western cultures.
You say this, but I’ve been on 5 two-pizza teams over the course of my career, and there were other women on every team except the 2 most toxic ones. My current team at a large fortune 500 is majority women. I realize this may not reflect the entire industry, and some fields may be more male dominated than others. But there are a lot of women programmers out there. You just need to pay them well and give them a good work life balance and they’ll work for you.
I do agree that there’s more we could do to attract women. The company I work for is known for good WLB so I don’t think that’s the issue. We only hire senior people every few years and I’m pretty sure we only offer market value, so it’s possible that is a problem.
That said, I think we actually have more women on dev teams than most companies do. Especially the back end teams, maybe because we have a lot more women in the engineering leadership there. It’s our FE teams, which are led almost entirely by men, where we have fewer women. So if we did start hiring again I’d really like to see us bring in more women at the top.
I’ve interviewed around 20 people since I started working here and only 3 candidates were women-- I don’t have any control over who the recruiter sends our way, so I don’t really know what kind of bias could be going on there. So it’s possible that’s a problem too.
All that said, hiring good engineers is really competitive and I think we do struggle against FAANG-likes already. Even though we have a lot of good benefits we have a reputation for being super boring and proprietary (think enterprise software like Oracle, but not Oracle thankfully), which turns a ton of people off. So it’s not easy to attract talented people to start with.
Tbf, the original photo was already discounting her abilities. Saying “can program code” for a lead SWE is saying like “can do calculus” for physicist.
In their defense, maybe the post was written by some journalist with no technical background at all and doesn’t know the difference.
Journalists are expected to do better. Otherwise, just hire anyone because even someone without any formal education could do better
Journalists are expected to do better.
When journalists were better paid, they did. Now most are stuck in race to the bottom content mills churning out as many posts as possible.
but haven’t you heard that glorbo is coming to world of warcraft?
Very much so. Many non-technical people are still very much in awe when someone drops names of programming languages. And it kinda makes sense. If they have no idea, they naturally equate it to spoken languages. And if someone goes like “I speak these 7 languages”, most people would be mightily impressed.
But if you know a few programming languages, adding another similar one might be a matter of hours.
And that list of languages in the article is pretty standard for a BS in CS: a bunch of standard, common languages and one assembly language.
Likely they covered MIPS assembly at university. MIPS is a comparatively simple architecture and thus is used a lot in CS courses.
The thing here is, if they really wanted to show off that she’s got a good carreer and doing something remarkable, they could have just done what she did in her comment. List her current position and maybe her education.
I’d not be very happy if someone were to present my skills and achivements as “Can use these programming languages”.
Also, once you’re moderately good at programming, language doesn’t matter much. You can pick up a new high level language relatively easily if needed. Low level languages might be harder for some people though, because it takes a fairly different mindset. Personally, I love low level programming, though it’s not very time efficient to write.
Yeah, once you’ve got a few languages under your belt, it’s all about concepts. If you end up learning a new language that follows completely different paradigms, you are back to square one. But most of the time you can go like “Ah, so concept X of the new language works similar to concept Y of that language I already know.”
It’s annoying sometimes that people just assume that those who don’t work in tech are completely clueless about tech.
It’s also really funny to mess with people who assumes that.
as someone who works in tech, the number of people who think they know about tech and are actually completely full of shit dramatically outweighs the people who don’t work in tech and do know what they’re talking about. it can take a lot of energy to differentiate the 2 groups
dunning krueger is at play a lot, because most people use a computer every day and think they know everything about the internet because they know what DNS stands for and typed a command to flush the DNS cache this one time and it worked
This mirrors the experience of anyone who has studied linguistics.
Because everyone speaks at least one language fluently, they tend to assume that they understand how languages work, while having zero awareness of the fact that people have spent generations studying language and communication at the PhD level and that almost nothing about what we reflexively intuit about language actually holds true.
And I say this as a purely amateur linguistics nerd who does not claim any real formal expertise in terms of academic credentials.
Yeah, you can’t really fake experience either. I recently joined a group of guys who clearly have had plenty of real world experience in the kinds of things I have, and just talking shop is refreshing. Haven’t had that ability for a long time.
If someone like her showed up in my team, and she’s able to talk the talk, I wouldn’t need any further validation and it’d be fun to hear the kinds of things she’s worked on.
Funnily enough, a woman is joining this all-guy group soon and I’m told she’s really good, so I get to do exactly that.
Don’t exhaust yourself, just assume that everyone who thinks they know about tech does. They’ll prove themselves wrong very quickly if necessary and you eliminate the risk of getting owned by a VS model.
except when you waste a crap load of time figuring something out only to realise that the person that says “it can’t be X” didn’t actually know that it was in fact X
… this is why you don’t argue with ISP support when they tell you to reboot your router: just do it; they don’t know that you’ve done that before you call them, and you telling them that’s not the problem is not going to change anything… it’s not because they don’t believe you specifically, it’s because they just can’t trust that everyone knows what they’re talking about
the same goes for most IT problems… it saves time in the long run to just assume people don’t know what they’re doing, because problems and systems are both complex and dynamic
Nah, ISP support (and many other support) just have a script they have to go through on every call.
I agree that rebooting your electronic device will fix a lot of issues.
But if those from support were actually any good, they would just reboot your router remotely.
that kind of reboot doesn’t do everything… turning the power off for 30sec completely discharges the capacitors in the power supply, as well as leaving time for things in the exchange to time out and reset
it’s a quick way of solving a mountain of issues, both client side and ISP side
some ISPs do have a script, some have better support than that but rebooting is a good strategy for a huge number of things because IT systems are just so complex
I feel personally attacked lol
I feel dumb.
Repeat after me : “it’s always DNS”
This is true, but also IT is a huge place there is an insane amount to learn. So really you spend an incredible amount of time in the “valley of despair”. Basically anyone who brags about their skills is VERY suspect. This person is an iOS developer, which is a great career, but the title of the article is phrased like she was at least Linus Torvalds. I’m sure she had little say in this, but whilst a reaction like this is never justified I can see why people made fun of it. Also it was clearly written by someone who has no idea what the words mean. Unless I’m mistaken MIPS is a cpu architecture, you can’t program in it. You can write machine code “for” it. So yeah I can see why people assumend these claims were lies.
They assumed these claims were lies because they are sexist.
I work in tech. I taught programming at university. And guys think I have no idea what I am talking about when I am the person correcting their f*ing babies homework. I had men come into my office asking me when the Sys Admin is back in office.
MIPS is processing speed. Definitely needs programming
MIPS is a CPU architecture.
But it needs programming right?
Well not really as such. MIPS is a CPU, yes it has microcode, but for argument’s sake, let’s assume the person in the article is not a CPU designer. I’m sure in the slightly sassy reply to internet trolls where he listed every achievement she could think of, being a CPU designer would’ve been mentioned.
So you can write program FOR a microprocessor. You can either do it in a very low level way, for example writing assembly or even byte code to a CPU directly, or in a very (well relatively) high level way, for example the Net Yaroze development kit for the PS1 (I hope the ps1 WAS a MIPS. The PS2 definitely was). Basically saying that you can “Program in MIPS” makes no sense as such, and to anyone who knows almost anything this hurts the credibility of the article simply.
Some fragile male egos in this thread. Looking forward to your complaints about the Barbie movie. Sad and pathetic.
I don’t know what you’re talking about. For me the fragile egos are way down the thread, all massively downvoted. The absolute majority is supportive.
People are addicted to rage.
A few arseholes on twitter saying negative things sets a chain reaction of rage to all those who are addicted to their own emotions.
The mature thing to do in all cases is to let it go.
It’s also worth noting that the original comments could be aimed at the fact she is a model, and not because she is a woman.
#zoolander
Not everybody’s sorting by Top, friend. They’re probably down there where you say they are though.
My comment on the Barbie movie …Kens belt buckle looks like a liny Metallica logo…horses are rad and Alan is terrible.
deleted by creator
Alan was literally MVP wtf
Lyndsey is an amazing software developer and champion of women’s rights.
Why would anyone care about an hour-long toy commercial?
Because that’s not what the movie is at all. It actually spends a fair amount of time mocking consumerism and hating on the negative impact barbie has had on women’s self image and feminism. It’s actually pretty crass with a lot of offcolor jokes. It’s more targeted to adults who had Barbies as kids during on the 80s/90s.
I did the Barbenheimer double bill. The one that felt like a.commercial was the “YU ESS EH” nature of promoting American War interests.
Oppenheimer forces the viewer to strongly consider the awful thing that was done those two days.
I’m as critical of the US as anyone I’ve met but your take is bizarrely ignorant to what they were trying to do. I feel like you’d have to be intentionally missing the point to come away thinking that movie was pro-america in any way.
can program code
Such a weird sentence
Am I the only one that doesn’t think it’s a waste if a gorgeous person does modeling/acting? If I had a body people wanted to ogle I would be using that power 24/7 instead of sitting here in a shitty office under fluorescent lights pretending to care about work while they pretend to care about me.
I’m not really sure what they’re referring too. Maybe they misspelled waist?
You know what. Good on her. Proud of her doing what she loves. You go girl!
A hello world in MIPS is impressive by itself.
I manage a software engineering organization at an aerospace company and if I had to rank all my folks, the women would be disproportionately high on the list. It boggles my mind that anyone would discount someone’s programming ability because of their gender.
“This paper presents the largest study to date on gender bias, where we compare acceptance rates of contributions from men versus women in an open source software community. Surprisingly, our results show that women’s contributions tend to be accepted more often than men’s. However, women’s acceptance rates are higher only when they are not identifiable as women. Our results suggest that although women on GitHub may be more competent overall, bias against them exists” nonetheless.https://peerj.com/preprints/1733/
I wonder if that’s the underdog effect at work
Sure. I’ve known several crappy women programmers, but they get pushed out of the industry. The guys are more likely to fail upward.
Last time I checked, I didn’t type with my penis. But to be honest, I didn’t try yet. Maybe I’d be able to increase my performance.
I’d be impressed by anyone who could “Hello, world” in MIPS
I won a competition during university, we had to implement a sorting algorithm with MIPS, however required the least cycles to run won.
I need someone to be impressed by me today, even if it’s for something stupid I did almost a decade ago.
I once lost such a competition, maybe even to you. You have my undying respect. No joke. Rock on!
Whenever I see someone taking down these absolute bottom of the barrel incel dork on social media, it just feels like shoo-ing a squirrel off the bird feeder. Just not even worth taking action
IMO, it’s always worth it because you dont know who is reading this: I imagine some young or teenage girls might see this-- imagine how they feel when they read the disparaging comments from the incels. Pretty dejected, I’d think. Then imagine how they feel when they read the model/engineer’s reply. It also shows boys what shite behaviour is.
It’s never a waste to shut the misogynists down-- it’s like investing in your future.
I’m with you. We don’t argue this stuff to change the original person’s mind, we argue it so that other people reading, who might have tendencies to feel that way, or who are the victim of it, get an opposing point of view.
Reading comments provide so much perspective. They’ve helped me plenty! Thank you to anyone who tries. <3
In this case the smackdown has gotten quite a lot of exposure. I only know about her because I’ve seen this same screenshot before.
This is some good shit. As a white American male, I say: fuck sexism and racism. You go, girl.
Intelligent and beautiful? Psh, what a waste
